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sladesounds 29th Aug 2014
| | As said the issue of media being simultaneously being available in more than one country can be a problem when listing it on this site. I can see the same happening over on discogs where a CD is listed several times, all with identical art work and packaging and identical Cat#s but listed separately over different countries
This CD is listed there with the Cat# here but three times as a UK, Europe, Australasia issue. Interestingly the Aussie disc they list comes in card sleeve (with the same barcode).
Simon rightly input this as an Aussie release as he can confirm it was available as a standard stock issue however my view is that where we know the item was for sale as a stock item in more than one country with the same artwork, cat#. track listing etc. then maybe the International flag may be more appropriate with details where know of which countries it was available in.
As plocky said there is more on this here. |
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plocky45 SUBS 29th Aug 2014
| | I think these posts do reflect the difficulties in submitting entries on the basis of good information (per Magic Marmalade comments) . Additionally, I wonder whether there should be other categories added (per Pomegranate's comments). If there is a European category, shouldn't there also be an Asian and/or Australasian category, for example. Perhaps it would be more appropriate to continue such discussions on the forums - this discussion seems highly relevant: https://www.45worlds.com/topic/100665
It seems to be about achieving a balance; the site philosophy appears to be towards simplification and thus the need to avoid overcomplication. |
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Magic Marmalade 29th Aug 2014
| | While this is a separate issue, it does allow me to raise a point here about something I've found quite frustrating... that's the overwhelming lack of official information about releases by the labels, and the companies that own them on the internet.
We're left to speculate or try and discern what we can about their products through our own observations, when you'd think it would be a simple matter, and not commercially sensitive to make such information readily available. Like the logic of which factory presses which releases for which markets, and how they go about determining these things.
You wouldn't have thought it would matter to them when talking about historical sales and pressings (deleted items), as they are not revealing anything about current incomes or anything that would expose them as far as tax would be concerned.
I had the idea of trying to establish some kind of genuine measure of rarity, on which subsequent valuations could be made... rather than apparently plucking numbers out of the air. I thought that if you could find out at least, exactly how many of a particular CD or LP were pressed, then you could have a legitimate number to base this on: How many actually exist/have ever existed, before you come to additional factors like sales, return to factory, loss over time, popularity, do people hold onto them, or do they move through the market frequently (albeit less of them exist (The Beatles stuff clearly had a lot more made than most other albums, but people tend not to let them go, causing a different kind of rarity than an album by an artist who only had a few pressed in the first place))
...but getting info like this is like getting blood out of a stone!
How much easier it would be if Decca, say, released their entire back catalogue info to the public, where you could see exactly what was pressed (that it actually ever existed), did it come to market, what market it was made for, and how many.
Certainly these kinds of discussions on this site wouldn't be necessary, let alone frequent if they did! |
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Pomegranate 29th Aug 2014
| | It wasn't your comment, Magic Marmalade. Perhaps there should be a group of nations comprising Australia, New Zealand, the Pacific nations (how many members do we have from the South Pacific, I wonder) -- and South-East Asia. I have seen many, many comments from both mods and members expressing the view that country of manufacture is NOT a factor in deciding where an entry resides but where it was sold. To quote one of the administrators when assessing an entry recently on 45cat:
A German manufactured disc but clearly also meant for the UK market ... can be on the database as both a UK and a German release. |
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plocky45 SUBS 28th Aug 2014
| | With the International cat. no at the top and UK cat. at the bottom, this is identical to the European issue. With multiple release countries that include European countries and Australia it seems that this should simply become 'International'. |
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Magic Marmalade 28th Aug 2014
| | I apologise if I caused offence. My comments were not intended to be unfairly critical.
The only reason I did comment was that I have been making this error myself recently, and have come to realise that CDs pressed in Austria are often intended for international markets, whereas those pressed in Germany tend to cater for European markets...
...and it's usually only when I look at the mould stamp that I find a country of manufacture given as Austria... nothing else on the CD label or case being too informative, except that the coincidence of ""Novercia" with this detail happens quite often, as a matter of my personal observation only. |
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Pomegranate 28th Aug 2014
| | The wrong country my foot! As a moderator, I take the job seriously and add only legitimate entries. I was 12,000 miles away from the UK when this was released in January 1992. Released locally in Australia, not as an import, at the stock $A price. |
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Magic Marmalade 28th Aug 2014
| | It's the old classic I think... I thought I'd seen a couple of my CDs the other day with "Novercia" on them... usually accompanied by: Made in Austria.
Also has UK and Int. Cat. Nos. |
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musicmasters 28th Aug 2014
| | Am I missing something here - this does not look anything like an Australian pressing? - it says BIEM/STEMRA on the labels and has a European cat. no.
It looks like this may have been assigned the wrong country? |
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