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With or without Barcode   


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  15th Dec 2021, 3:44 AM#1  REPORT  
zamla_71

ask little, receive alot!
Member since Jul 2020
3062 Points
Hi.

I got a copy of this one: (sort of)
https://www.45worlds.com/cdalbum/cd/vsopcd167

This release don't have a barcode if you look at the images.
Mine does, so do i add it as a new release or just put up images of the back cover with the barcode on the existing release?

Next question!
Got a copy of this one as well:
https://www.45worlds.com/cdalbum/cd/rtd19512402

Cat# and Barcode match, but the CD Face doesn't.
I got a Logo of a Swedish Record Label called Energy Records printed on the CD
with it's own Cat# ERCD 024. Also n©b printed.

Enter as a new release or not?

Thanx


  15th Dec 2021, 10:37 AM#2  REPORT  
Lee Wrecker

If you can't dig me, you can't dig nothin'
Member since Nov 2013
2271 Points
Hi zamla_71,
Well the first one, The Ronnie James compilation seems to be quite rare without the barcode 5015773912233 which seems to be common across all of the versions of this CD that incidentally all have the same cat#. So I can't see any harm in adding the barcode to this entry and a shot of the inlay that shows it. This would keep every version of this release on one page.
The second one Die Krupps tribute to Metalica would definitely warrant a new entry on the Energy label (we don't add the records part on 45 Worlds) and with its own specific cat# ERCD 024.
So that's what I'd do but I am not a Mod and just a site user that has entered quite a few CDs. I would also change the Ronnie James Dio release to EU as it was issued with that cat# across Europe and therefore that cat# is not exclusive to the UK. Hope that helps a little.


  15th Dec 2021, 11:59 AM#3  REPORT  
Magic Marmalade

If you're not lost... It's not an adventure!
Member since Jun 2014
3708 Points
Moderator
The joy of CDs! :laugh:

In the first instance, I agree with Lee, as the barcode in this case seems merely to be an "addition" of information to a pre-existing issue (If all else is the same)... And so belongs on that page.

Oddly though, it seems quite a late release not to have had a barcode on issue...

... barcodes beginning late 83 /84, about a year or so after the first CDs... CDs of this time will have that transition un-barcoded / barcoded... bit up in the air as to whether people think some un-barcoded ones should have a separate entry, as they are often regarded as of greater importance / value - a collectible "thing in itself" where the only slightly later ones with the simple addition of a barcode can be considered less collectible/ desirable / valuable / important to a marked degree.

I realise there's tons on site that should (depending on which view you take) should either be merged with other entries, or separated.

Other reasons why such a late issue (90s) may not seem to feature a barcode, and which should be considered, are whether it was initially issued in a slipcase, sporting that barcode, and which you may simply be missing, or an obi strip, as per Japanese issues, which carry the barcode... or simply that some particualr label didn't do it for whatever reason - Yazoo: Upstairs CD on Mute label, doesn't have one forsome reason, despite it's date of release.

The details given in your second CD warrant separate entry, there is a substantial difference to define it as a "different product" than the other.

It's not always clear, and no single rule can encompass the varying reasons and methods of all labels, without excluding others who fall outside that rule...and that's why I call it A-logical: they won't all go neatly into any one hole / system / method.

(Which is troublesome when trying to make them conform to a single system or guideline such as this site.... All we can do is throw tighter and tighter loops around the entries made, and adjust, or evolve the site (the theory) to fit the facts (The CDs etc.).

We can only do this, and get more accurate with the addition of more info / entries, in order to be able to say that this or that is more generally true.

I still think (And it is becoming more apparent) that club editions need their own separate entries, and a new "Format" needs to be added to the options to reflect this, as well as XRCD, and Maxi-CD / Single for CD singles world.

...One day, perhaps! :happy:

In the meantime, the method is- throw it up here on site, according to your best guess, and without fear of making a mistake, or getting it wrong, and we'll have more to work with, in order to be able to make more accurate determinations, and increase the probability of being correct... The fact that you ask implies you already had an instinct for what to do, but were worried it might be wrong.

Be fearless, as there's nothing that can't be fixed or hammered into shape later.

Bang 'em in, and we shall overcome! :thumbsup:


  16th Dec 2021, 11:53 AM#4  REPORT  
zamla_71

ask little, receive alot!
Member since Jul 2020
3062 Points
Hi.

Thank you Lee & Magic for your input and information :thumbsup:

all crystal clear now :wink:

on the other hand i got this PM yesterday concerning another release:

Hi
You added a scan of the rear tray artwork of Babylon AD CD to an existing entry which has a barcode.
Because your copy is the club release and does not have a barcode, a separate entry needs to be created for your copy, as they are not the same (i have asked the moderators to create a new entry, or, perhaps if you have time to scan the front of the booklet and Disc, you can add a new entry)
(When adding images to existing CD'S all details must match exactly Cat.Number/barcode/label, to be added to the same page, if they differ in any way, a new entry must be created)
hope that helps

Now things aren't so clear anymore!? :confused:

So this is what you did talk about, Magic. Different opinions how things should be entered to the DB.

Not easy to decide and one more thing. What exactly is a Club Edition and why should they be treated differently?

Thanx


  16th Dec 2021, 12:21 PM#5  REPORT  
Magic Marmalade

If you're not lost... It's not an adventure!
Member since Jun 2014
3708 Points
Moderator
Yes, the club editions are to be separate,

...Because they different information, not simply additional, or extra information:

Club Editions (Typically Columbia House, or BMG - which you will see printed on there somewhere, and not on the standard commercial release) were "sold" through direct marketing schemes / catalogue thingies, or like Britania music club type of schemes here in the UK, and they are almost promo like, in having the barcode removed, and where that ought to be, you'll see a noticeably sparse white rectangle, with the club catalogue number there instead: "D - - - - -" or such like.

The absence of the barcode and replacement with club catalogue number...

(Albeit alongside record label catalogue number, which will be the same on barcoded commercial release)

...makes it unique to that club as outlet, and shouldn't therefore, be found in a retail outlet / shop new.

They do similar things with books.

The reason I personally like these do to be separate, is to distinguish them from earlier issues that initially came out before barcodes, and are a method of dating the release... whereas early on, I myself thought: "Ooh, this one has no barcode, it must be early!" - when in fact, it's not, it's actually a later one that has no barcode because it was sold through the club.

This is important, in that CDs do not yet have quite the comprehensive knowledge base that vinyl has, in terms of collectability, but there are pockets of collectability growing for that format, for different reasons, and in this case, one that has been around for a while, is to identify early, pre-mastered issues "flat transfers" of albums, so that, how it appeared / sounded on the original vinyl, is how it would sound on the more convenient, and cleaner sounding CD format.

The absence of a barcode does a lot to help make that determination, along with the ADD etc. box, and CD face designs: Targets / Philips Blue face / Philips Blue Arrow / Mercury Green arrow etc.

So keeping these on separate pages helps identify which you might have.

But, as I say, if there's something wrong, we can always shift the furniture around until it looks right... but only if there's something entered to move around / work with in the first place.

Any member can submit a correction request if they spot something, as well as mod activity, so the onus is not on you to get it totally right straight off the bat. The site is designed to accommodate this.

So keep 'em coming! :thumbsup:


  16th Dec 2021, 2:26 PM#6  REPORT  
zamla_71

ask little, receive alot!
Member since Jul 2020
3062 Points
Thanx Magic.
That explains a lot.

I see that you have created a new entry for Babylon A.D. Club Edition, so i added some more pix.

Should the D-------- number be entered in the cat# field or the regular one printed on the release or maybe both?

Thanx


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