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Quad5point1 SUBS 26th Mar 2018
| | Added scan from the Music Master Metal Catalogue 2 confirming the April 1988 date |
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philwill SUBS 14th Jun 2017
| | Release date from Music Master 14th Ed. (1993) is April '88, so Jordansongs was intuitively close!
And Jaki Graham - Heaven Knows - CD FA 3181 comes in at July '88.... |
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gregs45s SUBS 6th Jul 2015
| | Indeed,my general rule-of-thumb is to look it up on Discogs then tap the barcode into Gurgle and try and find at least two other matches. It should perhaps be noted that this is my own personal way of searching,other people will of course have their own way,books etc,all are fine,and although 100% accuracy is of course our ultimate goal,it's not always possible first time around,a search may come up blank for-instance,it will all get sorted with time. |
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jordansongs 6th Jul 2015
| | It wasn't your eyes greg, someone on Discogs actually has listed an edition of "Killers" with the incorrect cat no. Just goes to show that while Discogs is a great resource, it's always worth viewing the information with a fair degree of suspicion! All the more reason for us good folks at 45worlds to make sure this is the place to come to for accuracy. :) |
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gregs45s SUBS 6th Jul 2015
| | Oh yes,apologies,i listed the wrong Cat.No. there (a bit bleary eyed last night:),FA 3122 is indeed "Iron Maiden".It is strange about the 81/82 thing also.As to whether Killers was released by Fame in 85,i came up empty handed,i have only found one other site that had May,85 for the CD release,but not much else,so to be honest,i'm in the dark on this one.I think sorting out these Fame release dates will require time,as usual though,i suspect we'll get there eventually :) |
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jordansongs 5th Jul 2015
| | That 3121 cat no for "Killers" is definitely incorrect, that belongs to the "Iron Maiden" CD. Just to add to the confusion, two of those editions of "Killers" on Discogs have 1982 on the disc and one has 1981! :D |
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gregs45s SUBS 5th Jul 2015
| | The Queen CD-FA 3040 was the one 1986 release i could find also
Discogs lists the following :
CD-FA 3122 Iron Maiden Killers 1985 x 3
CD-FA 3121 Iron Maiden Killers 1987 x 3
Who knows? |
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jordansongs 5th Jul 2015
| | It's certainly true that the CD issues weren't released in the same order as their vinyl counterparts. Of the three pre-87 CDs in gregs78s list, two are the Jaki Graham and Iron Maiden CDs previously mentioned while the third, CD-FA 3040 (Queen's debut album) was indeed released in 1986 (either Nov or Dec) alongside the rest of Queen's back catalogue (including "Queen II" also previously released on Fame). However, the original pressings had CDP cat nos but no CD-FA no and I believe they were issued at full price. These appear to have been reissued in 1992 with CD-FA cats (presumably at mid price), which is supported by the ℗1992 not seen on the original discs.
I still stand by my assertion that Fame issued no CDs before 1987! |
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gregs45s SUBS 5th Jul 2015
| | Could be,i can only find one entry of 1985 for the Jaki Graham CD on Discogs,so that could of course be wrong,however there are three entry's for 1985 on the Iron Maiden CD,so i would have thought that would have been spotted and rectified by now if it was wrong?,there are a lot of Maiden fans out there. The accompanying cassette issue was also 1985.So to be honest i haven't a clue without looking into it further. |
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gregs45s SUBS 5th Jul 2015
| | :-
35567 -unknown
CD-FA 3019 -unknown
CD-FA 3040 - 86
CD-FA 3095 -unknown
CD-FA 3101 - 87
CD-FA 3121 - 87
CD-FA 3122 - 85
CD-FA 3132 - unknown
CD-FA 3133 - 89
CD-FA 3134 - 89
CD-FA 3142 - unknown
CD-FA 3148 - 89
CD-FA 3149 - 89
CD-FA 3159 - unknown
CD-FA 3174 - 87
CD-FA 3175 - unknown
CD-FA 3177 - 96
CD-FA 3181 - 85
CD-FA 3187 - 88
CD-FA 3189 - unknown
CD-FA 3191 - 87
CD-FA 3192 - 91
CD-FA 3193 - 87
CD-FA 3195 - unknown
CD-FA 3198 - 89
CD-FA 3199 - 88
As you can see,dates all over the gaff :( |
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jordansongs 5th Jul 2015
| | gregs78s, I think it's highly unlikely that the CDs you mention were issued in 1985.
The Jaki Graham album was a brand new release in 1985 so it's inconceivable that Fame would give it a mid price re-issue in the same year as its original release. My initial investigations (just call me Columbo) puts that CD release down as a 1989 issue. 1985 seems a likely date for the Fame vinyl re-issue of "Killers" but I can't believe there would have been a CD issue to accompany it at that time. I'm going with a 1987 release for that one.
CDs were still a fairly niche product in 1985 with EMI only releasing their most high profile back catalogue items ("Dark Side Of The Moon" - CDP 7 46001 2 - was first out of the blocks in 1984). If memory serves correctly these were all full price releases, not mid price re-issues. I believe the watershed moment for CDs was the release of the Beatles back catalogue in 1987. One reason EMI gave at the time for the delay in the Beatles CDs is that they didn't have the factory capacity to satisfy the anticipated demand. With that in mind, it makes sense that EMI didn't enter the mid price CD market until this time. |
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Magic Marmalade 5th Jul 2015
| | That makes sense, if all the cat digit allocation had been done already for the vinyl as they went, they had a ready made pot of titles (with cats) to pick from selectively when it came time to issue CDs. |
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gregs45s SUBS 5th Jul 2015
| | Good nerding there jordansongs,i would however offer a note of caution before jumping to any conclusions about this confounded label,there are for-instance two earlier 1985 Fame CD'S :
Iron Maiden - Killers - CD-FA 3122 - CDM 7 52019 2
Jaki Graham - Heaven knows - CD FA 3181 - CDM 7 52067 2
as you can see,the Jaki Graham CDM Cat.No. is well after this Whitesnake release and yet it is possibly earlier in date.
So i'm not so sure about using the CDM/CDP prefixes as a dating guide,as some Cat.No's could have been held back/staggered.
Strangely i can only find one 1986 release so far.
Your efforts have inspired me to seek out the following :-
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Magic Marmalade 5th Jul 2015
| | I agree... the simple fact that not everyone had CD players when the vinyl issues were released would make it so that it wouldn't be economically efficient for EMI to release the CDs then, but hold back until the general public had machines aplenty.
Tapes may be another matter though.
(indeed, when the vinyl gets the 41-1s, the tapes get the 41-4s, but CDs don't have 41 anything). |
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jordansongs 5th Jul 2015
| | Having spent a wild Saturday night researching Fame CD releases, I would tentatively date this release as 1988, judging by the CDP cat no.
The first significant batch of Fame CDs I can find were from 1987. There is a consecutive sequence of 11 releases running from CDM 7 52017 2 to CDM 7 52027 2 all with (non-consecutive, obviously!) CD-FA cats. Among these were three McCartney CDs which several sources have dated the release as 5 October 1987. It's reasonable to assume (but not absolutely certain) that the others in this sequence were all released around the same time.
I haven't tracked down all releases between 7 52028 2 and 7 52052 2, but many of these were used by MFP (with CDB prefixes). Discogs has dated a few of these as 1988. CDP 7 52053 2 is allocated to this release, while CDP 7 52054 2 was given to another Whitesnake CD, "Ready An' Willing", although annoyingly Discogs gives that a 1989 release date. MFP uses a few more numbers directly after this sequence which Discogs has dated as 1988. I'm guessing the reason for the variations in the CDB/CDM/CDP prefixes is related to pricing. Obviously, we all know that consecutive numbers are not always released chronologically, but I think 1988 is a fair guess on this one.
There goes another crazy weekend! |
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Magic Marmalade 5th Jul 2015
| | I think the only way to get around dating the CDs is to see what other CD issues of this were on other labels (non-Fame) both before and after, and see what kind of date hole that leaves for it on Fame.
Then maybe looking at known dates for other CDs which may be in sequences in other ways (Label codes. barodes, Sids etc.?) see if that helps refine the date. |
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gregs45s SUBS 4th Jul 2015
| | Oh dear MM,we all feel for you,have you considered writing to EMI?.
Well i've had another trawl through the net and came back none the wiser,and although i now don't think this particular CD is as early as 82' (the label design looks later,and could be anywhere between mid-early 80's to 1990/92 perhaps)i'm still not 100% sure.Can a Whitesnake fan who bought this CD on the first day of issue please step forward :)(original receipt a bonus:) |
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Magic Marmalade 4th Jul 2015
| | I've got steam coming out of my ears now!
(bloomin' Fame label... more curve balls than the world series!)
I'd just take any date on Fame CDs as the Fame Title issue date (Regardless of format) for the mo, until we can see when they got the CDs going in relation to vinyl and cassette. |
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gregs45s SUBS 4th Jul 2015
| | Oh,were it that simple cptbbefheart,(although it still might be in this case),that's the trouble with these Fame releases (as MM knows too well;),pinning down dates is tough,and,as MM has probably found on the vinyl LP's,dates do not necessarily run consecutive with Cat.No's.I'm not sure,but i think CD's were issued with barcodes in 1982, so i suppose in theory this could be that early.(Interestingly it only has a 10 digit barcode).The other earliest CD release date i can find for this album is 1988 (US,different Cat.No/barcode).So it's a bit uncertain,unless a fan knows any better?. |
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Quad5point1 SUBS 4th Jul 2015
| | On image 788940 it quite clearly says 1982 for release year. Does that refer to this CD or a previous release ?? |
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gregs45s SUBS 4th Jul 2015
| | More scans added,corresponding FAME LP FA 41 3095 1,and cassette FA 41 3095 4,although i can't find dates for any of them. |
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