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| 27th Jun 2015, 12:55 PM | #21 REPORT | |
 | Neil Forbes Rock, Country or R. & B. - Classic Hits for me! Member since Dec 2014 252 Points |
Graham7 wrote:
4 gigabytes is the equivalent of around 16,000 maximum sized images on 45cat/45worlds, I think.
I too will look for Fame records on my shelves tomorrow. |
| 27th Jun 2015, 2:35 PM | #22 REPORT | |
 | Graham7 Member since Apr 2012 6406 Points Moderator | I've added an Ian Dury FA 3031 and added labels to Don McLean FA 3023. I've changed a few dates to bring at least the first page or so into slightly better order. Nothing is now dated prior to 1982. |
| 28th Jun 2015, 1:36 PM | #23 REPORT | |
 | Magic Marmalade If you're not lost... It's not an adventure! Member since Jun 2014 3745 Points Moderator | OK, I have begun by drawing up a simple list of every cat number for these in sequence, from 3001 - 3270 (Don't know yet if there was a 3000), and then assigning each of these the appropriate album listed here on this site (Will venture further later), regardless of date. Already there is a general pattern emerging, of a cluster of music "types" at any given time: a couple of proggy types together, a couple of hard rockers, then a couple of greatest hits of 50s artists together. (Again, assuming a chronological release for cat sequence... and by this assumption, only a very few seem to have the wrong date... which, if the general rule holds, proves them to be false) . Another observation emerges from this starting point: None of these releases before 1983, or after 1986 have the prefix: 41, and suffix: 1 around the central four digit cat number (e.g. 41 3130 1 - Kim Wilde), as all the cat numbers that have this are clustered together on my chart when placed in cat sequence (By no means definitive, but strong circumstantial evidence I'd say). ...So we're under way, and I'll just keep plugging away until it makes sense (Have to consider the discontinuation of vinyl releases in favour of CD too.) Will keep you posted. |
| 28th Jun 2015, 2:21 PM | #24 REPORT | |
| Magic Marmalade If you're not lost... It's not an adventure! Member since Jun 2014 3745 Points Moderator | Another line of inquiry I thought of that might help date them: What preceded the Fame issue, and What followed it. If there is a possibility that the same title, or it's equivalent was issued by EMI between the original release, and the Fame issue, then it would make sense that EMI wouldn't have, say two reissues of that album going at the same time, competing with one another... I think of greatest hits or singles albums here, like Eddie Cochran, Fats Domino ((T.Rex?) - who have two comps on Fame at either end of the apparent date range, so one issue of their work on Fame replaces an earlier one!)) etc. And of course, if that album, or equivalent was re-issued/ replaced by another EMI issue/re-issue of that work on a different label. (Pink Floyd's first two were originally on Columbia, which is why they were pressed on Fame, whereas all that followed was re-iisued/ repressed on Harvest (Black Labels) until very late eighties/ early nineties, after Harvest was no more, and then EMI put them out under their own name, and A Collection of Great Dance Songs (Originally Harvest) doesn't appear till later on Fame once Harvest has expired, and Floyd issue new releases under EMI). |
| 28th Jun 2015, 7:54 PM | #25 REPORT | |
| Magic Marmalade If you're not lost... It's not an adventure! Member since Jun 2014 3745 Points Moderator | Ooooh, my ed! Been trying to simply account for all titles in cat sequence on the net... Got the first page of 64 titles done, but a couple of weird anomalies have shown up in the context of the sequence: Can't find reference to two of them: FA 3013 is missing, and so is FA 3044. In the case of the former, either side of it are Dr Hook, and Carole King, so it's pretty easy listening, whatever it is. And the Latter, has Rose Royce previous, and Ricky Nelson after, so could be disco, or a 50s artist comp. The only other odd thing is FA 3026: The Best Of The Tavares, which can apparently only be found on cassette (So far). The other three pages are coming together gradually, and the pattern is very clear already, particularly concerning those with prefix: 41, and Suffix 1... all in the sequence from FA 41 3078 1: America - Silent Letter, right through to around FA 3152 or 53 (Haven't found 53 yet) have these appended numbers in the cat - no exceptions. (Bolan - Get It On: FA 3154, and all after do not have these extra digits). The last one in the whole Fame sequence I found so far was New Model Army: The Ghost Of Cain - FA 3237, and I reckon it doesn't go much beyond this number. (Calling it a day for now) |
| 28th Jun 2015, 8:14 PM | #26 REPORT | |
| Magic Marmalade If you're not lost... It's not an adventure! Member since Jun 2014 3745 Points Moderator | In best Columbo style: ...Just one more thing... It occurred to me that Pink Floyd's Relics was re-issued on MFP (Music For Pleasure), so wondered if Fame and MFP were related (Others probably already know this), and indeed they are... Internet says that Fame was a "Sub-label" of MFP in the 80s, but if you look at the MFP discography (here and elsewhere), you see MFP cat numbers go up to around the 3000 mark, then jump to 5000 cat numbers.... so there's a "Fame" sized hole (plus more) in the MFP sequence, of the right digits, so this would seem to be why Fame starts at 3001 specifically. and what's more, some MFP cat numbers have a prefix 41, and suffix 1 around the central number... and with a few of the artist compilations appearing on both labels (Eddie Cochran, for example) the use of these appendages may be to distinguish them from each other... maybe (?) |
| 29th Jun 2015, 6:49 AM | #27 REPORT | |
 | nboldock Lend me ten pounds and I'll buy you a drink. Member since Feb 2012 7198 Points Moderator | Sterling work MM. Classics For Pleasure uses the same numbering convention as well - that would account for some of the numbers after Fame (they're in the 4xxx range by the looks of things). |
| 29th Jun 2015, 11:53 AM | #28 REPORT | |
| Magic Marmalade If you're not lost... It's not an adventure! Member since Jun 2014 3745 Points Moderator | I think the numbers for Fame (On Vinyl) runs to about 3240 or so, then it goes to cassettes and CDs. ...which is today's discovery: Tapes have the suffix 4, where vinyl has the 1. So if you see this appended to the four digit cat#, it signifies format. CD-FA ---- (CDs) FA 41----1 (Vinyl) TC-FA 41----4 (Tapes). Got the second page done, up to 41 3134 1 (Whitesnake - Ready An' Willing) with only 8 that can't yet be account for. An amendment is that the 41 1 appended digits are present on issues earlier than I stated previously (Some people give the whole cat#, and some don't- which makes it confusing, so when searching, I have to see an image of the label for myself now to be sure.), I think now it starts around 3067 or 3068 (Can't find an Image of Sammy Hagar - Nine On A Ten Scale, yet, so can't say if this has them or not). Other odd thing is that 3100 McCartney, 3101 - Wings - Wildlife, 3102 - Lennon - Plastic Ono Band have the original label designs, just with Fame numbers on... did someone say "Special Treatment"? |
| 29th Jun 2015, 12:17 PM | #29 REPORT | |
| Magic Marmalade If you're not lost... It's not an adventure! Member since Jun 2014 3745 Points Moderator | Also, I wonder if the choice of format digit is specific to the label, as it seems MFP have the 41 and 4 on only a couple, but others have 41 and 9. (What the 41 signifies, I don not yet know). Certainly we are dealing with a larger re-issue picture here, of which MFP, Fame, Classics for Pleasure, and probably a couple of others before it all goes purely EMI, are a the pieces, but eventually we should be able to have a sequence from 1 to 5000+ unbroken through all these labels. As Fame only runs to about a couple hundred (3 maybe) vinyl discs, I won't take too long to account for them all, and then start dating them (then label variant dates too). ...And this makes me wonder if maths may be of use here, in that we know the label was started in spring (March 1982), and followed the pattern of reissuing 4 -5 discs per month (maybe six) each year March to November = 8 months, at 5 discs per month, say, over 8 or so years = 320 discs (?) But that begs the question of where did the other discs over 300 go? so it would be more likely t be 3 or 4 per month 8 years x 8 months x 4 discs per month = 256, which is more like the figure the cat numbers suggest. In which case, where we have a month(s) with more than 4 releases, one in that month may be wrongly dated. |
| 29th Jun 2015, 1:31 PM | #30 REPORT | |
| nboldock Lend me ten pounds and I'll buy you a drink. Member since Feb 2012 7198 Points Moderator | There's also the Hour Of Pleasure cassette label which again uses a similar numbering convention, though they seem to be in the range 8xxx so thankfully we can ignore those! I assume they were cassette only. |
| 29th Jun 2015, 3:06 PM | #31 REPORT | |
| Magic Marmalade If you're not lost... It's not an adventure! Member since Jun 2014 3745 Points Moderator | we'll have to factor that one I too nboldock. It seems a picture will slowly emerge. |
| 29th Jun 2015, 3:07 PM | #32 REPORT | |
| Magic Marmalade If you're not lost... It's not an adventure! Member since Jun 2014 3745 Points Moderator | The first 50 Fame label releases in sequence: (FA) --3001- The Stranglers – Stranglers IV (Rattus Norvegicus) --3002- Whitesnake – Trouble --3003- E.L.O – E.L.O 2 --3004- Be Bop Deluxe – Sunburst Finish --3005- T.Rex – Solid Gold --3006- Olivia Newton John – Making A Good Thing Better --3007- Steve Harley And Cockney Rebel – The Best Of Steve Harley And Cockney Rebel --3008- Hawkwind – Masters Of The Universe --3009- Motorhead – On Parole --3010- Cliff Richard – I'm Nearly Famous --3011- Deep Purple – In Rock --3012- Dr. Hook – Sometimes You Win --3013- ? --3014- Carole King – Pearls: Songs Of Goffin And King --3015- Linda Ronstadt – Linda Ronstadt --3016- The Band – The Best Of The Band --3017- Gene Vincent – Greatest Hits --3018- The Beach Boys – Pet Sounds --3019- Eddie Cochran – The Best Of Eddie Cochran --3020- Del Shannon – Live In England --3021- Bobby Vee – The Singles --3022- Bob Seger And The Silver Bullet Band – Night Moves --3023- Don McLean – American Pie --3024- Helen Reddy – I Am Woman --3025- Juice Newton Silver Spur – Come Home --3026- Tavares – The Best OF Tavares --3027- Minnie Riperton – Minnie --3028- Tom Robinson Band – Tom Robinson Band --3029- Dr. Feelgood – Down By The Jetty --3030- Steve Miller Band – The Best Of Steve Miller Band --3031- Ian Dury And The Blockheads – Greatest Hits --3032- Dexy's Midnight Runners – ching For The Young Soul Rebels --3033- Stephen Bishop – Careless --3034- Captain Beefheart And The Magic Band – Unconditionally Guaranteed --3035- Sparks – No. 1 In Heaven --3036- The Jets – Jets --3037- Japan – Quiet Life --3038- Kim Carnes – St. Vincent's Court --3039- The Knack – Get The Knack --3040- Queen – Queen --3041- Julie Covington – Julie Covington --3042- Frankie Valli – The Best Of Frankie Valli --3043- Rose Royce – The Best Of 'Car Wash' --3044- ? --3045- Ricky Nelson – Singles --3046- Fats Domino – Singles --3047- Spyro Gyra – Spyro Gyra --3048- The Kinks – Sleepwalker --3049- Eric Carmen – Eric Carmen --3050- Barry Manilow – Tryin' To Get The Feeling Edited by Magic Marmalade on 5th Jul 2015, 1:10 PM |
| 29th Jun 2015, 3:50 PM | #33 REPORT | |
| Neil Forbes Rock, Country or R. & B. - Classic Hits for me! Member since Dec 2014 252 Points | I should be getting the sleeve artwork an labels for FA-3012 Sometimes You Win(Dr. Hook) on this site by this coming weekend, MM. Another thing. Catalogue numbers don't always run in sequence, I've found. Many moons ago I bought Roy Orbison's Greatest Hits on a Festival-issued Monument cassette, and also bought its nominal follow-up, More Of... at the same time. Looking at the catalogue numbers, the "More Of..." release was numbered earlier than that of what should've been its predecessor!  Most confusing indeed! |
| 29th Jun 2015, 4:14 PM | #34 REPORT | |
| nboldock Lend me ten pounds and I'll buy you a drink. Member since Feb 2012 7198 Points Moderator | Absolutely, but Fame does run in sequence, or so it appears. |
| 29th Jun 2015, 4:22 PM | #35 REPORT | |
| Neil Forbes Rock, Country or R. & B. - Classic Hits for me! Member since Dec 2014 252 Points |
nboldock wrote:
Absolutely, but Fame does run in sequence, or so it appears.
|
| 29th Jun 2015, 4:53 PM | #36 REPORT | |
| Magic Marmalade If you're not lost... It's not an adventure! Member since Jun 2014 3745 Points Moderator | I think there may be a possibility that a couple (few?) of these may have been released out of sequence (date wise), but with the dating of them being all over the shop... where they are known at all ... I thought this would be the best way to start trying to make sense of it. This is only the first stage... next (once all cat numbers have their corresponding titles, I can apply the "known" dates where we have them for a few issues, then see what pattern emerges from that... ... stage three will be to apply other relevant info and see what difference that makes (The original album release - except in the circumstance of a compilation - previous reissues (I have an Undertones debut reissued on their Ardeck label after the original Sire release, and which then appears on Fame, which will push the available date range for that a bit narrower). Then if there's still narrowing to be done before a final fix, we apply the label design progressions, and then the release scheme of Fame- so many per month, over so many months, for so many years... Any odd ones will stick out like a sore thumb after this process, and eventually we'll have the dates for each and every one to the week.  ...Elementary my dear Watson! (Just keep panel beating the facts till they make a good shape) |
| 29th Jun 2015, 5:17 PM | #37 REPORT | |
| Magic Marmalade If you're not lost... It's not an adventure! Member since Jun 2014 3745 Points Moderator | More! (up to 3099): --3051- Joe Walsh – You Can't Argue With A Sick Mind --3052- Steppenwolf – Steppenwolf Gold --3053- Wishbone Ash – Classic Ash --3054- Camel – Camel --3055- B.B. King – The Best Of B.B. King --3056- Cozy Powell – Over The Top --3057- (Ian) Gillan – Mr Universe --3058- Patti Smith Group – Easter --3059- The Blues Band – Official Blues Band Bootleg --3060- Tubeway Army – Tubeway Army --3061- The Shadows – The Shadows --3062- Average White Band – Show Your Hand --3063- Tygers Of Pan Tang – Wild Cat --3064- Cliff Richard And The Drifters – Cliff --3065- Pink Floyd – Piper At The Gates Of Dawn --3066- The Tubes – The Tubes --3067- Barry Manilow – Barry Manilow 1 --3068- Sammy Hagar – Nine On A Ten Scale 41 3069 1 Steely Dan – Count Down To Ecstacy 41 3070 1 Nils Lofgren – Cry Tough 41 3071 1 The Alan Parsons Project – Eve 41 3072 1 Bob Seger System – Mongrel 41 3073 1 Barclay James Harvest – Once Again 41 3074 1 Thompson Twins – A Product Of... 41 3075 1 Gary U. S. Bonds - Dedication 41 3076 1 Little Feat – Little River Band 41 3077 1 Rich Kids – Ghosts Of Princes In Towers 41 3078 1 America – Silent Letter 41 3079 1 David Gilmour – David Gilmour 41 3080 1 Scorpions – Love Drive 41 3081 1 The Beatles – A Collection Of Beatles Oldies 41 3082 1 ? 41 3083 1 The Stranglers – La Folie 41 3084 1 E.L.O – E.L.O 41 3085 1 Steve Miller Band – Sailor 41 3086 1 Jethro Tull – Stand Up 41 3087 1 Q Tips (Featuring Paul Young) – Q Tips (Featuring Paul Young) 41 3088 1 Linx – Intuition 41 3089 1 Blondie – Parallel Lines 41 3090 1 Dave Edmunds – D. E 7th 41 3091 1 The Beat – I Just Can't Stop It 41 3092 1 Haircut One Hundred – Pelican West 41 3093 1 Deep Purple – Fireball 41 3094 1 Kate Bush – Lionheart 41 3095 1 Whitesnake – Love Hunter 41 3096 1 Hawkwind – Road Hawks 41 3097 1 David Coverdale – North Winds 41 3098 1 Japan – Obscure Alternatives 41 3099 1 Queen – Queen II Edited by Magic Marmalade on 4th Jul 2015, 6:19 PM |
| 29th Jun 2015, 5:54 PM | #38 REPORT | |
 | Steptoe Keep your glow on Member since Sep 2011 995 Points | Enjoying the discussion and well done for the great work so far MM. I have added pics of the only Fame LP I have in my collection, FA 41 3094 1 - Kate Bush 'Lionheart' which has an alternative label to the one already on the site. As i have mentioned in the comments, the original inner has '284' on the bottom right which may or may not be for Feb 84 as a release date |
| 29th Jun 2015, 6:06 PM | #39 REPORT | |
| Magic Marmalade If you're not lost... It's not an adventure! Member since Jun 2014 3745 Points Moderator | It's all useful Steptoe... Thanks for that. It's going to be tedious trawling through the discography wave after wave, for different stages of the process, but it needs to be done eventually... People on ebay ad elsewhere selling these dated everywhere from the stone age to next centrury! They need accurate dates for them some time... might as well get stuck in and get it done. (also useful info regarding other non-fame issues, and the individual artist discographies as far as dates are concerned when it's eventually done) |
| 29th Jun 2015, 6:54 PM | #40 REPORT | |
| Magic Marmalade If you're not lost... It's not an adventure! Member since Jun 2014 3745 Points Moderator | Another line of inquiry: ...Regarding the 41s and 1s... They begin sometime around 83 (Don't know for sure yet), and continue for some time till about 86/87. It just occured to me that if the 1 element is significant of format, and the need to distinguish format, this would be about the same time CDs came along (although having had a mosey, it seems EMI were pretty late in the game - maybe they had more prep to do, having such a massive back cat to consider, as well as current issues). ...But then I wondered why they discontinued the practice, and reverted to the un-appended four digit cat numbers (CDs didn't go away!). Then I remembered what we were saying about MFP. The only logical reason to discontinue the distinguishing digits is that you no longer need to ditinguish between items on this label, and another.... so either the other label has a new system, or no longer exists.... ...and although the last MFP entry on vinyl here is dated 1989, it's discontinuation could help define dates for Fame.... in that if MFP can be said to be no more at a certain date, and this corresponds to the reversion to simple four digit numbers in fame, we can take that last MFP date as reinforcing the date for the first 41-1-less cat number on Fame. |
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Vinyl Albums : Live Music : 78 RPM : CD Albums : CD Singles : 12" Singles : 7" Singles : Tape Media : Classical Music : Music Memorabilia : Cinema : TV Series : DVD & Blu-ray : Magazines : Books : Video Games : Create Your Own World
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45worlds for music, movies, books etc : 45cat for 7" singles : 45spaces for hundreds more worlds