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| 3rd Jul 2015, 4:01 PM | #81 REPORT | |
 | Neil Forbes Rock, Country or R. & B. - Classic Hits for me! Member since Dec 2014 252 Points |
Magic Marmalade wrote:
Rim text for all UK Fame labels:
"All rights of the producer and owner of the recorded work reserved. Unauthorised copying, hiring, renting, public performance and broadcasting of this record prohibited. Manufactured in the UK by EMI Records Limited" Yet somehow, while the black rim text goes from about 10-11, round to 1-2, those with red rim text squeeze this same text into a space between 9-10, round to 2-3... Except when the grid is removed, and the plain labels go back to the 10-11 round to 1-2 (please don't ask me why!) |
| 3rd Jul 2015, 4:04 PM | #82 REPORT | |
 | Magic Marmalade If you're not lost... It's not an adventure! Member since Jun 2014 3747 Points Moderator | did you see label I just uploaded on previous page Neil? I guess they squished the writing, but why go back later? |
| 3rd Jul 2015, 4:09 PM | #83 REPORT | |
| Neil Forbes Rock, Country or R. & B. - Classic Hits for me! Member since Dec 2014 252 Points |
Magic Marmalade wrote:
I'll look at that this evening TopPopper, thanks. (once I've had ten cups of coffee!)
Neil, would you say your Dr. Hook labels are this startling yellow: Found on musicstack Edited by Neil Forbes on 3rd Jul 2015, 4:25 PM |
| 3rd Jul 2015, 4:17 PM | #84 REPORT | |
| Magic Marmalade If you're not lost... It's not an adventure! Member since Jun 2014 3747 Points Moderator | Abso-diddley-utely! (Now that's what I call a yellow Fame label!) Just found one on Pink Floyd Archives for Piper At The Gates Of Dawn, but it's an Irish press (Just trying to narrow to UK ones for the moment - although the rim text on the label says made in UK, contrary to the label print!):Piper At The Gates Of Dawn - YELLOW Basically, when referring to a yellow label, it ought to make yer eyes bleed! |
| 3rd Jul 2015, 4:22 PM | #85 REPORT | |
| Neil Forbes Rock, Country or R. & B. - Classic Hits for me! Member since Dec 2014 252 Points |
Magic Marmalade wrote:
Abso-diddley-utely!
(Now that's what I call a yellow Fame label!) Just found one on Pink Floyd Archives for Piper At The Gates Of Dawn, but it's an Irish press (Just trying to narrow to UK ones for the moment - although the rim text on the label says made in UK, contrary to the label print!):Piper At The Gates Of Dawn - YELLOW Basically, when referring to a yellow label, it ought to make yer eyes bleed! MM, Wanted to put my label up with yours for comparison but can't find URL(wish the 45cat method applied here, much easier to use image number!) Accidentally deleted you image in my reply, not lost altogether though, still there in your post. |
| 3rd Jul 2015, 4:27 PM | #86 REPORT | |
| Neil Forbes Rock, Country or R. & B. - Classic Hits for me! Member since Dec 2014 252 Points |
Magic Marmalade wrote:
I'll look at that this evening TopPopper, thanks. (once I've had ten cups of coffee!)
Neil, would you say your Dr. Hook labels are this startling yellow: .jpg) Found on musicstack Might be a few shades lighter on mine than this one. This is what you call "Toxic Yellow" |
| 4th Jul 2015, 2:30 PM | #87 REPORT | |
| Magic Marmalade If you're not lost... It's not an adventure! Member since Jun 2014 3747 Points Moderator | On the verge of a break-through with this label's vinyl issues... but need more data to be definitive... But generally, if all the issues on the list I posted are squeezed into a tighter time frame from may 82 through to the end of 85 for initial release, then a lot of the facts start to fall into place, and the maths begins to add up. (It's the label variations that have extended/later dates). But most appear on the light brown/vanilla/banana -red grid label before the end of 84, then the label experimentation begins in 85. ... with 86 being the year of the repro label. Basically, it looks like more were issued per month than previously thought, with seven being the magic number: May 1982- November 1982 = 7 months x 10 releases per month takes you to the seventy releases (actually 68, but there's a couple of fine points to be worked out) of the initial un-appended cat numbers, before the addition of the 41s and 1s in the new year of 83. This 41-1 cat sequence continues for about 84 (possibly 86, but there's couple of cats missing yet at ether end) releases in 1983... over the same release schedule of May to November, this gives 7 months at 12 releases per month = 84 With EMI's first CDs appearing in 83, the necessity of format distinction explains this appended scheme throughout 83... also, the barcodes start to appear on sleeves about here. Following the same release schedule for the following year: 84, of seven months at 12 per month, gives another 84 (un-appended cats - don't know why yet), which adds to 238 releases since may 82 to November 84. Approximating to my list (certainly within the ball-park). I think this squares the label changes up too.. why so many appeared on the bananavan grid label so late in the sequence, the buggering about with label designs in 85 (brief yellow grid somewhere around the end of 85, with white grid too, before the plain light brown/white labels take over... yet to fix a date for the label repros, but looks like it could be 86. And finally, those pesky dark brown plain labels I believe are not a simple variation on the plain light brown, but are EMI's own artist catalogue repro labels! ...they just didn't want to go back to the tan/dark brown with big red EMI letters labels... so these are contemporary with the custom repro labels for other label's artists. EMI's own CDs with CDP prefix begin in 83, and Marillion: Script For A Jester's Tear appears on this (On site), but Fame's (As distinct from EMI label) begin therefore, in 84.... don't know if that Marillion title appears on Fame CD yet (Should, if it's on Fame Vinyl), but that would mean it replaces the EMI one- probably making that original EMI CD pretty bloomin' rare! So those are my deductions for the day, just have to set about proving them out, and snagging little holes in the scheme. Edited by Magic Marmalade on 4th Jul 2015, 2:36 PM |
| 4th Jul 2015, 2:49 PM | #88 REPORT | |
| Neil Forbes Rock, Country or R. & B. - Classic Hits for me! Member since Dec 2014 252 Points |
Neil Forbes wrote:
Magic Marmalade wrote:
I'll look at that this evening TopPopper, thanks. (once I've had ten cups of coffee!)
Neil, would you say your Dr. Hook labels are this startling yellow: Found on musicstack Might be a few shades lighter on mine than this one. This is what you call "Toxic Yellow" |
| 4th Jul 2015, 4:49 PM | #89 REPORT | |
| Magic Marmalade If you're not lost... It's not an adventure! Member since Jun 2014 3747 Points Moderator | New detail: Sammy Hagar: Nine On A Ten Scale has no 41-1 cat... so the first in that sequence is 41 3069 1 - Steely Dan - Countdown To Ecstacy. (List amended). |
| 4th Jul 2015, 5:17 PM | #90 REPORT | |
| Magic Marmalade If you're not lost... It's not an adventure! Member since Jun 2014 3747 Points Moderator | Couple other things... the early vanana grid labels with the Source logo on are the first 30 releases (Omitting a couple, due to being EMI's own titles... in one case, they just put a little red EMI box at the bottom of the label, and on Olivia Newton John: Making a Good Thing Better - they just didn't bother at all, even thought the publisher credits for each song is EMI, the label text says: "Original Recordings Made By Olivia Newton John") So that's the first three months of releases, then they stop. (ooh, and there's a toxic yellow label for Cliff Richard - Wired For Sound on ebay). Also, just tried to see how far the Fame cat sequence went (regardless of format) and as I said, pretty much ran out of vinyl around 3258 (there may be a few more) but all CD hits on the search engine after that till Pet Sounds appears again! - on CD at 3297 (if I recall), then no hits for any Fame release after that on any format... so it's likely the label terminates at either 3299, or 3300. |
| 4th Jul 2015, 5:36 PM | #91 REPORT | |
| Magic Marmalade If you're not lost... It's not an adventure! Member since Jun 2014 3747 Points Moderator | As well as MFP, it's worth paying closer attention to Capitol records too, a lot of the artists cross between them and EMI, and they have a prefix-ed four digit cat sequence in the eighties from 1000s to 2000s. |
| 4th Jul 2015, 6:22 PM | #92 REPORT | |
| Magic Marmalade If you're not lost... It's not an adventure! Member since Jun 2014 3747 Points Moderator | Scrub that bit about the source logos terminating in the first thirty... Fats Domino has one at 3046! (there's always one isn't there?) Couple of holes in the sequence filled: 41 3075 1 - Gary U.S Bonds - Dedication 41 3150 1 - Meat Loaf - Bad Attitude (List Ammended). |
| 4th Jul 2015, 6:37 PM | #93 REPORT | |
 | jordansongs🍰 Member since Jan 2010 732 Points | Mr Marmalade, from previously having little interest in the Fame label, you have now got me studying as many labels as I can find!  Am I right in thinking that apart from EMI (who are the parent company anyway) it is only Liberty and Capitol who had their logos added to the labels on the first 30 releases? For example, should there not be Harvest logos here:   Strangely, there was no Capitol logo added to this one:  Or are these later pressings? Apologies if I am adding to the confusion! Edited by jordansongs on 4th Jul 2015, 6:46 PM |
| 4th Jul 2015, 7:58 PM | #94 REPORT | |
| jordansongs🍰 Member since Jan 2010 732 Points | Interestingly, on further inspection (it's Saturday night, I need to get out more...), a large proportion of the first 30 releases were originally either Capitol or Liberty/United Artist releases, I counted 20 in all. Of the others, 3 were Harvest releases and the rest were originally on EMI. Regarding the missing FA 3013 issue, is there a chance it was left out due to superstition? I believe it's known as triskaidekaphobia (easy for me to say!) |
| 4th Jul 2015, 8:44 PM | #95 REPORT | |
| Magic Marmalade If you're not lost... It's not an adventure! Member since Jun 2014 3747 Points Moderator | I'm not sure about the tripinthelightfantatstic-er- um- phobia, uh, tricksy-decca... tipsy-deck, er... (that word). ...but I sure feel like I've bitten off more than I can chew here! At first, I thought it would be a simple thing to pin dates on just 250 or so discs, but once you find it's cat number tentacles extend into MFP and Capitol, the CDs, represses, re-issues of re-issues, missing titles and who knows what else, you don't know which way is up after a while! I did wonder if they might have left 3013 out for someting like that, and 3113 too... but I found that (Rafferty -Sleepwalking) in a record bin, so wouldn't rule it out yet... did occur that omissions could be in the sequence as marking some siginificant dates, like a new year, or to demarcate groups of releases, but there's no discernable pattern there to suggest this. One other thing I was thinking was that maybe, with the availability of other formats like cassettes and then CDs, some artists may sell better on them due to the taste of a typical fan of that artist: Hot chocolate may appeal to their typical fan in the most convenient format of tape, say, whereas a prog title may do better on vinyl due to the more "serious" fan.... so maybe one or two may only exist on another format (EMI was a business after all), leaving gaps in the sequence for a given format when this occurs. We've yet to see if the CD release dates exactly match the vinyl, even with the same cats, as this would be 83-84, so who had a CD player then? Maybe they issued the sequence on CD begining on a later year. I am wondering though if those earlier 20 or so may have the subtlest of label vairations occuring here, where the initial logo bearing labels were quickly exchanged for log-less ones, and nobody would be the wiser! ... but that said... look at the Dr.Hook label in that horrible yellow I posted... That label variation occurs about 85 or later, and yet still bears the Capitol logo... so this makes me think that once the design for text etc. is established, it's used all through the label changes regardless of the design of the label it's printed on. (there was an album I came across earlier (think it was earliest Whitesnake) which has the odd black splat of a logo near the top of the label... is it Sunburst label???) |
| 4th Jul 2015, 8:53 PM | #96 REPORT | |
| Magic Marmalade If you're not lost... It's not an adventure! Member since Jun 2014 3747 Points Moderator |
jordansongs wrote:
Mr Marmalade, from previously having little interest in the Fame label, you have now got me studying as many labels as I can find!
Am I right in thinking that apart from EMI (who are the parent company anyway) it is only Liberty and Capitol who had their logos added to the labels on the first 30 releases? For example, should there not be Harvest logos here: Strangely, there was no Capitol logo added to this one: Or are these later pressings? Apologies if I am adding to the confusion! This is difficult to tell, because they show the scanning variations, and also the fact that some labels are actually a shade or two lighter... and to add to the fun of the fair, I'm certain a plain white red grid label is about, just before the switch to plain light labels. (True white label appears briefly around the same time as the toxic yellow... these earlier are on the coloured vinyl Pipers, which must be special editions pressed later than the normal Fame Piper - oddly, not seen or heard of any other titles in the fame cat pressed on coloured vinyl!) |
| 4th Jul 2015, 9:21 PM | #97 REPORT | |
| jordansongs🍰 Member since Jan 2010 732 Points | Regarding CDs, to take Beatles-related releases as an example (where there is probably more data available than most artists) "Wings Wild Life" was not released on CD until October 1987 but was given the CD-FA 3101 cat no which matches the 1984 vinyl release (albeit without the 41-1 additions). It seems to have been released the same day as "McCartney II" (CD-FA 3191) and "Red Rose Speedway" (CD-FA 3193) which may or may not be the same time as the vinyl releases. Confusingly, Macca's other 1984 Fame release "McCartney" was released earlier in 1987 and has no Fame cat no. And just as your deciding what you're going to use to tie your noose with, "John Lennon/Plastic Ono Band" (1984 vinyl cat no - FA 41 3102 1) was released on CD in 1988 without a Fame cat no but was re-issued with one (CD-FA 3310) in 1994. On the plus side, I've spotted a vinyl copy of the Tavares "Best Of" on ebay! |
| 4th Jul 2015, 9:50 PM | #98 REPORT | |
| jordansongs🍰 Member since Jan 2010 732 Points | Here's something else I found on ebay, Iron Maiden's "The Number Of The Beast" with two different label designs on one record!  |
| 5th Jul 2015, 1:21 PM | #99 REPORT | |
| Magic Marmalade If you're not lost... It's not an adventure! Member since Jun 2014 3747 Points Moderator | I've amended the list regards the Tavares (removed the Cassette only note)... well spotted! (unfortunately no label image on the page, but seeing as it's early in sequene, and the sleeve has no barcode, it would be safe to say it has a vanilla red grid label... and in the first thirty, and on Capitol, who have a nice big logo on the back of that sleeve , it's a likely bet the label has a Capitol logo on too!). That Iron maiden one is a bit of a bonus... I get to fill two blocks on my chart for labels in one hit!!! And what a rarity!!!! ... I'm half tempted myself at only a tenner.... seeing as the later cluster of Maiden Fame labels go for £40-£50 a pop... this would fall squarely into the "Mispress" category, and if the seller had labelled his listing as such, and offered biding, who knows what it would achieve! If you see any other Fame labels of interest on your travels, it'd be great to see those too (missing titles in the list too). |
| 5th Jul 2015, 1:34 PM | #100 REPORT | |
| jordansongs🍰 Member since Jan 2010 732 Points | Re: Fame CD releases, some fevered research has unearthed what I believe to be the first significant batch of releases (possibly from October 1987): CDM 7 52017 2 (CD-FA 3101) Wings - Wild Life CDM 7 52018 2 (CD-FA 3121) Iron Maiden - Iron Maiden CDM 7 52019 2 (CD-FA 3122) Iron Maiden - Killers CDM 7 52020 2 (CD-FA 3132) Deep Purple - 24 Carat Purple CDM 7 52021 2 (CD-FA 3142) Marillion - Real To Reel CDM 7 52022 2 (CD-FA 3175) Saxon - Denim And Leather CDM 7 52023 2 (CD-FA 3188) The Undertones - The Undertones CDM 7 52024 2 (CD-FA 3191) Paul McCartney - McCartney II CDM 7 52025 2 (CD-FA 3192) Hawkwind - X In Search Of Space CDM 7 52026 2 (CD-FA 3193) Paul McCartney & Wings - Red Rose Speedway CDM 7 52027 2 (CD-FA 3159) Cliff Richard - Wired For Sound This is the only significant consecutive Fame sequence I have found so far, there are others but only in batches of 2 or 3. The 7 520** 2 numbering sequence was also used by Music For Pleasure and Classics For Pleasure (and possibly other EMI budget releases). Where it's going to get really confusing is that later Fame re-issues use the original 7 digit cat no of the first issue. For example, Kate Bush's "The Kick Inside" was one of EMI's very first CD releases in early 1984, issued as CDP 7 46012 2. When it was re-issued at a lower price by Fame (one source suggests September 1988), it was given a CD-FA 3207 cat no but also retains its original CDP cat no. I reckon this could make dating a large number of Fame CD releases as nigh on impossible! |
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Vinyl Albums : Live Music : 78 RPM : CD Albums : CD Singles : 12" Singles : 7" Singles : Tape Media : Classical Music : Music Memorabilia : Cinema : TV Series : DVD & Blu-ray : Magazines : Books : Video Games : Create Your Own World
Latest » Items : Comments : Price Guide : Reviews : Ratings : Images : Lists : Videos : Tags : Collected : Wanted : Top 50 : Random
45worlds for music, movies, books etc : 45cat for 7" singles : 45spaces for hundreds more worlds