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45worlds Forums » 78 RPM » View Topic
| 50000th 78! |
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| 9th Apr 2016, 12:18 AM | #1 REPORT | |
 | darrenst Member since Dec 2015 445 Points | Uploading a batch of Columbia, and I just got this 50000th item uploaded to 78RPM firework display! I'd post a picture of it but no idea how... Darren |
| 9th Apr 2016, 8:11 AM | #2 REPORT | |
 | Orbiting Cat Member since Jan 2008 1181 Points Administrator | 50,000!  Does anyone have an idea on how many 78s there are? A very rough estimate... |
| 9th Apr 2016, 10:55 AM | #3 REPORT | |
 | Juke Jules SUBS Tell me he's lazy, tell me he's slow Member since Jan 2011 4138 Points Moderator | Exactly the same number as 45s  One interesting aspect of 78s is that until, I guess, the 1930s the technology did not allow large pressing runs from one master, so if the record sold well, the artists involved would have to keep going back into the studio to re-record the track. The same catalogue number might be used on many different recordings. |
| 9th Apr 2016, 12:03 PM | #4 REPORT | |
 | nboldock Lend me ten pounds and I'll buy you a drink. Member since Feb 2012 7198 Points Moderator |
Juke Jules wrote:
Exactly the same number as 45s
One interesting aspect of 78s is that until, I guess, the 1930s the technology did not allow large pressing runs from one master, so if the record sold well, the artists involved would have to keep going back into the studio to re-record the track. The same catalogue number might be used on many different recordings. That's quite an interesting notion. |
| 9th Apr 2016, 3:45 PM | #5 REPORT | |
 | Redpunk SUBS Crates Are For Digging Member since Aug 2012 25322 Points Moderator | There is far more 78s produced one would have thought than 45s as 78s were produced from 1900 to 1960 compared to 1950 to 1990. Also there was no other format for them all to compete with such as cassettes, CDs etc. for most of their existence. I would hazard a guess that the number worldwide of different 78s released would be well over the million mark. |
| 9th Apr 2016, 5:26 PM | #6 REPORT | |
| Juke Jules SUBS Tell me he's lazy, tell me he's slow Member since Jan 2011 4138 Points Moderator | The industry for making 78s was probably not so large and global as for 45s, but I'm thinking 10-20 million for 45s around the world. So far the only parts of the world that are well represented here are Western Europe, North America and Australia/NZ. Imagine we could have front pages in the major Indian languages, Arabic, Chinese, Russian and Japanese and started getting significant contributions from these lands. Front pages in Spanish and Portuguese would also expand our reach in South America. Also, we can only speculate as to what proportion of records were private pressings, never issued for sale. This will include promotional records, school choirs and bands, and a relatively few private recordings for birthdays and special events, and I suspect we've barely scraped the surface of these in the three major regions. Edited by moderator on 11th Apr 2016, 6:32 AM |
| 9th Apr 2016, 6:57 PM | #7 REPORT | |
 | Jock_Girl A girl who looks good in vinyl Member since Dec 2012 1544 Points Moderator | Do we know how many of those 50,000 have images? Amy |
| 9th Apr 2016, 8:26 PM | #8 REPORT | |
| Juke Jules SUBS Tell me he's lazy, tell me he's slow Member since Jan 2011 4138 Points Moderator | We have 85,000 images, which makes it about 85% |
| 10th Apr 2016, 8:16 AM | #9 REPORT | |
| Orbiting Cat Member since Jan 2008 1181 Points Administrator |
Jock_Girl wrote:
Do we know how many of those 50,000 have images?
Amy Exactly 40040 which is 80% |
| 10th Apr 2016, 8:19 AM | #10 REPORT | |
| Orbiting Cat Member since Jan 2008 1181 Points Administrator |
Juke Jules wrote:
The industry for making 78s was probably not so large and global as for 45s, but I'm thinking 10-20 million for 45s around the world.
So far the only parts of the world that are well represented here are Western Europe, North America and Australia/NZ. Imagine we could have front pages in the major Indian languages, Arabic, Chinese, Russian and Javanese and started getting significant contributions from these lands. Front pages in Spanish and Portuguese would also expand our reach in South America. That's a lot! I think less, maybe 2-3 million. It feels like 45cat is starting to get there in terms of being complete. I think the reason the countries you mention are underrepresented is because there was much less vinyl output. I hope I'm wrong though, would love to see 10 million new unknown records! |
| 10th Apr 2016, 3:48 PM | #11 REPORT | |
 | TopPopper Member since Mar 2013 2612 Points | I suspect there are mountains of singles as yet waiting to be added. There are multiple new records being added every hour, and from major market countries like USA and UK. (Latest added - I just looked - two Tamla Motowns from Spain). If we were close to completion, I suspect this kind of stuff would all have been covered off and we'd be getting just a trickle of highly obscure stuff. It's already an incredible database, but I expect it will keep growing for a long time yet. And I also think there's probably a lot of stuff out there in far-flung countries. I added this a long time back - is it really the only Diana Ross single or even Motown single ever released in Kenya? Somehow, I doubt it. There could be dozens, maybe hundreds! Who knows? Edited by moderator on 11th Apr 2016, 6:34 AM |
| 11th Apr 2016, 3:38 AM | #12 REPORT | |
 | xiphophilos Member since Dec 2013 3351 Points Moderator | There are definitely millions of individual 78 rpm records still out there. I myself own a bit more than a 1000 records, and 80% of these I had to add to this database because no prior entry existed. Now I wouldn't say that I own only rarities; on the contrary, most of my records are probably quite common. Based on this, I'd say that there are at least another 200,000 common records made in the US alone out there, and I'm sure that's still extremely lowballing it. Now if we consider that the market for 78s was far, far more international than it appears on this site, we get to millions and millions of records. Right now, we only have the tiniest of fractions of some country's record production in the database. To mention a particularly stark example, our database contains exactly one (1!) Chinese record (and 7 from Hongkong). As early as 1904, the Gramophone & Typewriter Company listed 476 Chinese titles in its catalogue. Columbia had made more than 1,000 Chinese-language records by 1906! The German Beka produced at least 500 Chinese records, the US company Victor thousands before World War II. And these are just four companies (for the numbers, cf. http://www.capsnews.org/apn2008-1.htm and https://excavatedshellac.com/2014/07/). One last example: The database contains 196 Indian records. According to the site http://www.mustrad.org.uk/articles/indcent.htm, more than 500,000 different gramophone record titles were issued in India alone. Edited by xiphophilos on 2nd Apr 2018, 2:51 AM |
| 11th Apr 2016, 7:52 AM | #13 REPORT | |
| Orbiting Cat Member since Jan 2008 1181 Points Administrator |
xiphophilos wrote:
According to the site http://www.mustrad.org.uk/articles/indcent.htm, more than 500,000 different gramophone record titles were issued in India alone.
Amazing! |
| 11th Apr 2016, 9:07 AM | #14 REPORT | |
| fixbutte Member since Jan 2013 1483 Points Moderator | My first guess (before Redpunk and xiphophilos had posted their estimates) was five million. We know that (RCA) Victor, the most prolific US label, had to introduce a new numbering system in 1942 because they had run out of five-digit numbers, so there were about 100,000 different 78 rpm Victors alone in the USA at that time, with around 15 years to follow. Based on that I assume that about 1 million different 78 rpm records were released in North America alone. Considering that Europe and Asia had a much bigger population in the first decades of the 20th century, I deduced my 5 million guess, somehow confirmed by xiphophilos' numbers. |
| 15th Apr 2016, 12:54 AM | #15 REPORT | |
| scrough🍰 No picture 'cos I'm not into 45rpm :( Member since Jan 2013 3428 Points Moderator | Victor sold 797,437,101 records between 1901 and 1941 (honestly! I looked it up). That's an average of ~8000 records per catalogue number which is quite small, so some Victors ( and many of the other big companies outputs) are probably extinct.
Quote:
One interesting aspect of 78s is that until, I guess, the 1930s the technology did not allow large pressing runs from one master, so if the record sold well, the artists involved would have to keep going back into the studio to re-record the track. The same catalogue number might be used on many different recordings.
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| 2nd Apr 2018, 4:01 AM | #16 REPORT | |
| xiphophilos Member since Dec 2013 3351 Points Moderator | Just found a couple new numbers: Victor and RCA Victor recorded around 200,000 78s overall (Bruce D. Epperson, More Important Than The Music: A History of Jazz Discography, Chicago 2013, page 160 and 197). Between 1900 and 1925, over 100,000 78s were issued (ibid., page 206). |
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